stpap77
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Jmm stops valero for sure! Jmm is the true lightweight champ |
Swodogg
said:

Jandro83
said:

| DAMN i gotta give credit to Valero what a fight, DeMarco is one of my favorite fighters (he reminds me of my style in the ring lol), hes an excelent boxer and man can he take a punch, Valero couldnt even put him down, but he battered him till his bodyjust shut down, and i also was having doubt of Valero being one deimensional since he rarely raises his guard, but last night he showed he doesnt need guard cause his foot speed and head movement is phenomenal, also showed alot of heart and determination with 3 cuts on the right side one of them a split open forehead which u could see the skull, damn he's tough, but still i say before he faces JMM i want him against Katsidis next, now thats a fight of the year winner for sure. |
355X6 Bench
said:

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That four year old must work for hbo. |
355X6 Bench
said:

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The Flomo fans can dream all they want, it wont change the outcome of this fight at all. Your boy is still getting stomped like a nark at a biker rally. |
MAR210TX
said:

sikwitit78
said:

| valero would kill marquez ..marquez in the twilight of his career maybe like 2-4 years ago marquez would give him a great fight but i think hes to old to hang with valero and as for katsidis doubt he would make it past 8rds hes a come forward guy ..with valeros speed,power,foot work,and work rate would be a one sided beating |
Jandro83
said:

Jandro83
said:

355X6 Bench
said:

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That is true Marquez cant fight anymore. Katsidis is hype, when he fights hard opposition, he looses. He lost to a real old Casameyor.Valero will have no problem at all with Kat or Jaun. |
victor76
said:

MAR210TX
said:

| i think everyone is hating on valero, sure he hasnt faught the best...yet! jus look at what hes shown us so far, what boxer can you name that has 27 wins and 27 kos their first 27 fightz, u cant! like valero said, a star was born, and i think he should fight juan diaz or nate cambell, maybe even malignaggi, i think he deserves a shot at someone because of his KOs he shouldnt be treated as a unexperience fighter, hes good for his experience |
355X6 Bench
said:

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I agree Mar, but to answer your other question. The only to other fighters that started their records like that are three that I can think of: Acelino Freitas 27-0-27, George Forman 35-0-35 and onother fighter by the name of Sugar Shane Mosley 28-0-28. To comment on Valero's power,it is difficult to measure because De Marko has a great chin and he still has a 100% ko pr. So saying his power is overated? How much better can his power be? |
JoeLuis
said:

| Valero power or no power he sure got skills. Valero's Pros - he showed lots of heart, foot work, accurate punching and his punching from angles wasnt bad either A-la pacquiao. Cons- It seemed as Demarko hit harder than valero. (it might just be me). Demarco's timing was off, i can see bradley or even old marquez contering him all night long, even a KO. Don't count Marquez out just yet, He can adapt and neutralize any fighter at 135 that is. |
sikwitit78
said:

| valero will kill katsidis yeah kat won his last 2 fights but look at the oponents jesus chavez..and cant remember other guy but neither were a elite fighter and he got hit alot ..and again marquez was hurt by juan diaz who isnt even a puncher and is isnt as fast as valero...i say miguel acosta would beat katsidis |
355X6 Bench
said:

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You make good points Joe but, Marquez is not the same fighter anymore. No reason to compare. The truth is Valero looks to have the goods. Hell get sharper in time.Right now we are in the middle of the JR. welter resurgence not seen in years,Valero(soon),Bradly,Marquez,Harris,Cambell,Chavez ,Peterson,Holt,Hatton,Alexander and Khan @ 140.The most talent in the world is really at 140. That said I think we need another round robin tourney @ 140 to see who is king.Welter is great as well cuz the three best Fighters in the world all reside in that weight.(Mosley,Money,Pac) |
MAR210TX
said:

| Valero Needs to fight a more known and more skilled boxer, not sayin demarco wasnt good, he had one hell of a chin, but i wanna see him fight a juan diaz, or malagnaggi, or nate campell, maybe even a erik morales lol, i want his nex fight to be a step up, so every one will stop hating on him, he is boxing proffesionals and knockin em out, this man is one hell of a boxer |
MAR210TX
said:

355X6 Bench
said:

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No that Is actully acurate, Mosley was 28-0-28,Acelino Freaitas 27-0-27 Forman 35-0-35. Those Stats come out of my book "Boxing Greats" By Steve Bunts. Google and Yahoo dont always pull the stats correctly. |
MAR210TX
said:

355X6 Bench
said:

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Most computer based websites rely on computer info to fill their stats, no one can remember everything. Which is ok but younger fans like yourself get robbed of the real fact somtimes,because you dont read books, you read computer info to be filled in. Thats all ok but the best facts come from books. I can tell you that Shane Mosley and Acelino Freitas's records are spot on because they happen to be in my all time top twenty and I watched them from the ametures to present. I also know that you are in your late teens to early twenties, because you dont know who "The Brazilian Bomber" Acelino Freitas is. You might want to youtube him, in his prime he was a Monster. |
MAR210TX
said:

sikwitit78
said:

Jandro83
said:

| Who said Katsidis' is gonna lose? ever since his loss to Diaz, he started training in Thailand and now he's a beast, didnt u see how he battered 2 mexicans? not any chump can destroy mexicans like he did, the Diaz fight although he lost he didnt give a bad show, and the Casamayor fight he started bad, but then was making a huge comeback and i say the ref shouldnt have stopped it, Casamayor was gassed and Kat was winning on all cards, and dont say Casamayor was old cause if u watch the Casamayor/JMM fight closely JMM was clearly losing on points, if he didnt KO Joel i doubt JMM wouldve won a decision. |
Jandro83
said:

| oh and by the way Brazilians were made for MMA not Boxing lol, boxing requires true skill and brazilians have never quite excelled, the last one was Pinto with an olympic silver medal, but when he turned pro Cotto got his revenge (lost to pintp twice at amateur) and ended retiring Pinto from boxing lol. |
sikwitit78
said:

sikwitit78
said:

JoeLuis
said:

Hey bench i hope that ure not basing your marquez statement because of his last fight. (nah i know u better than that ) I can't argue that he is not as quick as previous years but he performed well vs pacman cus of his way of adapting and will power not quickness. another thing to mention is that he fought pacman which has a very similar style than mini pacmanvalero so he knows what's coming. Demarko was killing valero with the jab in the first rounds add marquez precision punching and we might get a great fight. Another thing is that I dont think valero can take a punch, I saw demarko hurting him at least twice.+ eventhough valero does have what it takes to be in the Elite, he still has many flaws. look at it this way, Marquez has fought the best as of not so long 09 and looked decent but on his way down and Valero on his way up and hasnt fought any great ones so they meet in the middle. Either way it would be great for valero to have a V over marquez, it would give him great exposure, etc. I agree super 8 tourney at 140 would be great for boxing. I also agree on internet sites lying sometimes. So.. does anyone knows if chavez lost when his career had started? im confused on that one. Acelino freitas. I loved his technique but when he was touched he dint want anything to do in the ring. Great fights though vs barrios awesome KO. Hey bench make a list of good boxing books outthere im interested in reading true facts. |
355X6 Bench
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Joe he never lost at the beginning of his career. Chavez fought his first fight in 1984 |
355X6 Bench
said:

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Against a guy by the name of Miguel Ruiz, he knocked him out at the end of the first round right as the bell sounded, they called it a dq win for Miguel but changed it the next day, from a dq win for Ruiz to a deserved ko win for Chavez. |
355X6 Bench
said:

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A few boxing books that you might like are. "Boxing Greats" by Steve Buntz, "King of the World",Ali rise of an american hero by David Remnic,"100 Greatest Boxers of all time", By Bert Sugar." Sugar Ray", by Ray Robinson and "Men of Steel" the life and times of great middle weight champions. |
matchmaker
said:

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if i was arum. i would get valero a title at 140 vs the slower urango rather than bradley. then fight marquez at 140. a ko over marquez would set up a pacquiao fight as a huge event. if marquez can stay active but not take any beatings till then i think he has a chance of beating valero. lets see if it happens. |
355X6 Bench
said:

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That would actually be good at 140, Valero still wins. He is not ready for Bradly. Bradly is one of the top 10 in the world. |
sikwitit
said:

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yeah at 140 valero would prob have trouble with top guys..needs test the waters first with a light puncher like malinagi or maybe even jr witter hes kinda old now but would not rush to put valero in with ..urango,devon, def not bradley.....1st fight malinagi then if willing to risk it. theres holt,torres,demitrius hopkins, and if wants risk and money got victor ortiz,madaina,khan,nate man theres so many match ups |
Jandro83
said:

| well records r manipulated sometimes, when Camacho fought Chavez on the tale of the tape it said Camacho was undefeated, but it was wrong since he lost a decision the year before, and well that fight between Chavez/Camacho was one of the biggest bullshit decision in boxing history lol, Camacho outworked Chavez over the 2nd half he deserved that decision (hell if u watch it in spanish on youtube the announcer is mexican and hes all nuthugging Chavez but after rnd 5 when the tables turn u can hear him all craping his pants and barely commenting anything cause chavez was getting outboxed lol) and the decision was 119-109 once and 120-108 twice all for Chavez, bullshit decision. and i dont care what the people say Chavez Sr. in my eyes doesnt even come close to Juan Manuel Marquez, JMM is truely the best that has ever come out of mexico. |
Jandro83
said:

| i wouldnt put Valero up against Torres at 140 too much risk neither Maidana, as for Ortiz, he showed he has no heart and Valero would break his spirit within the 1st 4 rounds, Urango well if he comes with poor peformances like against Hatton and Berto Veleros winning that one too, Khan is just perfect for Valero, hes not too big and Valero showed he has speed and most importantly presicion and well we all know its Valeros power vs Khans glass chin. |
sikwitit
said:

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yeah torres high risk low reward but madaina would be good and would draw maybe not ppv but man would boxing fans want to see it ..id prefer valero vs madaina over any other fight except bradley it would be a barn burner but his promoters wouldnt do it to high a risk they would want to milk him for a few now if he faces bradley and loses they would have no choice but to take risky fights....then again all premature have to see if he can even perform at 140 |
355X6 Bench
said:

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Well Jandro I have to disagree Holeheartedly on Chavez cus he beat the hell out of the Macho Man. He also holds the record for most Championship fights (37) and the most defences @ 140 (26)He went 9O fights in a row 70 by Ko to win 6 World Chamionships titles before he sufferd his first loss to Franky Randal. And to top all that off he holds the biggest live gate in modern history 130,000 poople @ the fight with Greg Haualgan.And then came back to avenge the loss. Any longtime boxing fan will tell you that Marquez is a great fighter but will never be compaired to Chavez. Chavez is rated by boxing fans and afficianotos as not only the greatest Mexican fighter,but,of all time, he is in the top 5 ALL TIME! Sorry Brother but you are COMPLETELY wrong! Chavez is simply a living Legend. 90 Fights in a row without a loss, think about that and then add in that he only fought 12 ameture fights and it makes that acomplishment even more impressive. |
355X6 Bench
said:

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Heres another Snipet 4 u, When Chavez fought Meldric Taylor he made him and Camacho piss pure blood for a week after the fight because he hit so hard to the body. |
JoeLuis
said:

| I second that. Chavez was a natural born boxer indeed. even his skin would never cut or bruise! The only reason he started loosing is cus his bad havits caught up to him and age ofcourse. He should've retired at El Azteca Vs Haugen. Sal Sanchez in the other hand, was a gym rat and no1 in my list of fav mex-fighters. tnx for the info B-man. |
355X6 Bench
said:

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Salvador was Auwsome, to bad he didnt live. |
Jandro83
said:

| well ive seen the Chavez/Camacho fight quite a few times and well i just dont see Chavez winning, hell uts the only fight ive seen Chavez outworked to the point of actually getting tired, and if u dont believe me whatch the later rnds and see how Camacho was outpunching him in exchanges and Chavez wasnt hurting him anymore, also i was talking once with my trainer about the Chavez/Taylor fight and we both concluded that was a fishy fight, it was like the Margarito/Cotto fight, but in that case Taylor was giving Chavez an even worse blanking than Cotto was giving Margo, Chavezbarely landed any punches and Taylor was just as busted up as Cotto was, i just dont buy it, i dont doubt Chavez couldve loaded some gloves once in a while cause if he truely was such a heavy puncher he wouldve had over 90% KO wins dont you think? also if u compare resumes, JMM fought much higher caliber opposition than Chavez did, if Chavez were to travel to the future and fight Pacquiao he wouldnt have done even half the things JMM was able to do to the Pacman. |
Jandro83
said:

355X6 Bench
said:

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Your a Camacho fan and thats cool.But there was nothing fishy about Chavez. Sports Illistrated did a ardicle on him and tested his punching power with a machine and had concluded that he was "The Strongest Man In The World" based on punching power.Camacho later said after the fight with Chavez to Ring Mag that "He lost the fight with Chavez" and had regrets. You are still saying your man won when he said he lost. His ko % was great also, he finished his career with 107-6-86, thats damn high. There is no record of peds or wraped hands with him.I wont try to change your mind cuz you are a Macho Man fan and there is nothing wrong with that. |
JoeLuis
said:

| PR vs Mex is a great rivalry, lets leave it at that hehe. I also remember camacho admiting defeat when he got interviewed. Class act from camacho and/or R.E.S.P.E.C.T. I'll give you this one: Chavez did loose to Pernel Whitaker. So is Valero fighting Juan diaz at 140 in Texas? wtf! Valero vs Soto would've been nice to see, oh well. |
355X6 Bench
said:

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I am not arguing that, what I am saying is Chavez was astonishing at his best. The Guy went 90-0-70kos for pete sake.He has been in more Championship fights then anyone in the history of the sport EVER. (37) Marquez,Morales,Berrera,Ricardo Lopez,and Tony Margarito will all say Chavez is the Greatest Fighter From Mexico, and to top it all,This guy is their Idol.Being a boxing fan for thirty years I can tell you this guy at his best would have handled any of the guys on this list,and him and Manny Would have been pure Magic at 140. |
Jandro83
said:

Jandro83
said:

Jandro83
said:

355X6 Bench
said:

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JMM is not better at all, he fought his floyd of the day and lost. Chavez fought Meldric Taylor who was faster then Floyd and considered the best in the world, who also won a gold metal not silver and was undefeted. Chavez thrashed him to the tune of a brocken cheekbone fractured ribs (3) and ruined his career.Did I mention that he pissed pure blood for a week after the fight? Chavez's record had a little padding just like any fighter out there, but after 25 fights he started fighting the best,unlike his son. I know May was bigger then JJM but he fought like he was showing too much respect, Chavez never did that. The thing thats funny is that Camacho himself admits he lost and you still think he won.JMM admited that Chavez was greater than him and you still think he is better. I cant convince you cuz you are blindly biast in your opinions,and that is ok cuz I used to be young too. I just state mostly facts and less of my opinion. |
Jandro83
said:

355X6 Bench
said:

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Thats ok Jandro, Martinez beat the hell out of PW, and in the post fight interview said the judges made "an eror", but he didnt really complain.It doesnt matter though cuz Macho Man only won 3 titles and Chavez won 6. |
Jandro83
said:

355X6 Bench
said:

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Did you know that JMM lost to Freddy Norwood and Cris John? Those guys Chavez would have killed. JMM's Titles 3 Chavez 6 . |
Jandro83
said:

355X6 Bench
said:

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Chavez didnt run or get knocked on his ass like Nacho did. Chavez in his prime would rape JJM. |
355X6 Bench
said:

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JMM's Titles 3 Nacho Girl 3 Chavez 6 |
Jandro83
said:

355X6 Bench
said:

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I own the fight! Chavez never ran. Hector ran away from Chavez when he fought him to, Hector was in survival mode most of the fight with Oscar and Chavez. Look I met Hector during the Promo of the fight with Oscar, he was nice enough but no one could understand what he was saying, he was punch drunk then and this was in 97, not to mention those queer outfits he would wear. Who was his designer, Elton John? |
Jandro83
said:

| lol he was pretty flamboyant, but man you gotta learn to distinguish between running and boxing, watch the Trinidad/DLH fight, THATS running, watch Mayweather/Judah, THATS running, Camacho moved side to side countering and FLURRYING, thats called boxing, while PBF and DLH were going backwards and throwing NOTHING in return on those fights, thats running, are you gonna say that Calderon also ran from Cazares? |
355X6 Bench
said:

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I know the diffrence between running and boxing, your running when your loosing and your boxing when you winning or hurting your oponent, Chavez never got hurt by Macho cuz he cant break an egg. And you are bashing Chavez's ko % (83%) when Hecters sucks.(50%) Chavez's record 107-6-86 Hector's 79-5-38? Any way I dont call those outfits Flamboyant, Those are Flamerboyant. |
sikwitit78
said:

| LMAO camacho was very,very good boxer but that S curl and those outfits were def flameboyant could have been much better if wasnt for the nose candy ...chavez def greatest mexican did have alot of bums to about halfway of career but man he made up for it in the later years .chavez and duran the most body crushing blows in boxing ..would have love to put these guys in a time machine and have them face of in there primes would have been the greatest fight ever |
355X6 Bench
said:

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Thats right Sik! Duran and Chavez @ 140 both about 28 years old, you talk about pure SUPERFIGHT. |
355X6 Bench
said:

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The other Great Fights would be Pernel Whitaker vs Floyd. Ray leonard vs. Shane Mosley, and Meldric Taylor vs. Tim Bradly. Paul williams vs. Tommy Hearns.and Ray Robinson vs a prime Roy Jones. |
sikwitit78
said:

355X6 Bench
said:

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Koysta Tzu was a monster. |
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